Lofton's Amp. WOW!

[dannopelli]

I am late for work, so I'll give more detail later today...

So Lofton brought his amp over last night. In short, it is a SMOKING version of a 12 watt Fender '57 5E3 style amp. Rich sounding. Very warm. Lots of growl too! You would love to record with this amp, do small gigs too, or even big gigs if you stick a mike in front. Build quality was impeccable.

Again, more details later. Gotta go now!

[dannopelli]

First let me say that Lofton, (ConnemaraGuitar), is one of the nicest, and most interesting guys I have met. While we did play some guitar and tested his amp with a number of instruments, we also had a lot of time to talk and visit, eat some pizza and drink a beer. In fact we probably spent as much time visiting as we did playing guitar. I had a GREAT time and really appreciate him giving me the opportunity to test drive his amp. Lofton also brought a couple of guitars he has made. They are great too, but I'll focus on his amp here.

Let me start by saying, that if this financial situation we all are in was not happenning Lofton likely would not have left with his amp. I liked it that much!

Ok, so the amp is a replica of a 12 watt 5E3 57 Tweed, but built in an elegant hand made dovetail joined hardwood seperate head and closed back ported 1x12 V30 cab. The build quality was impeccible. There is still a tiny bit of minor finish work to do, a grille for the speaker cab and back of the amp. But that is it.

We tested with a variety of single coil and humbucker equipped guitars, including: Anderson Hollow Classic Swamp on Alder VA5's, Hollow T Classic Swamp on Ash, TV1 TV3, Hollow Cobra S M1 M1 M3; PRS Hollow I; Gibson LP 57 Classics; Fender 60's NOS Strat and 60's NOS Tele both with Texas Specials.

We tested the amp with his cab as well as the speaker cab in a Fender Twin.

I was really not that familiar with this type of circuit, or this amp. I've never owned one and the amps I have generally used have a lot more clean headroom. It took me a few minutes to get used to the early break up, (around 9:00) and tone control parameters. In short I had to learn what this amp's "purpose" was. And I can say it accomplishes that purpose famously.

I did some background work reading reviews on similar amps by Fender, Victoria, Lil Dawg, etc. This amp is voiced a bit darker than others, but in a good way. It is not at all flubby. It has nice articulation.

The normal input is great for blues, and with the PRS Hollow, or HTC, or any of the S guitars with the volume rolled off the neck PUP it was just smokey. Running some jazz chords and riffs were nice and brown, but still airy with the PRS. Tighter with the LP but still warm.

The bright input was more agressive, and once past breakup just got more compressed and smooth, but still very articulate. Rock rhythms were just solid sounding as could be. Solos on the neck PUP of the LP and the Cobra S were all Santana, and bridge leads on any guitar were very dynamic, yet still warm.

For me the most satisfying sounds came when I jumped the inputs. Plugged into bright I was able to find an excellent balance that would work for me in a gig. You do need to get used to going to around 6 or so on the guitar volume to get clean, but it is still a bit dirty. But I do not use crystal clean, so I can get warm clean from it.

Interestingly, it took pedals well too. I punched in a Mosferatu, a Zendrive, and a BB, (not at the same time) and it just pushed the amp into a creamy saturation. Chorus and delay sounded nice too.

I should point out that the speaker cab had nice dispersion to it. Considering its size I found that a bit surprising. As you would expect, it did not spread as quickly as the open back 2x12, but it was far better than the Mesa 1x12 or even the Z Best 1x12 I own. And the Z best is loaded with the same V30 as Lofton's.

If you need crystalline clean, what you get from say a Hughes and Kettner, or even high headroom warm clean from a 65 Twin, this is not your amp. Even with the guitar backed to six to get clean, it was still had a bit of dirt.
But it is not meant to be a clean amp. If you play rock or modern country it works for you. Awesome for blues. Jazz too, you just need to know how to work the volume controls on your guitar.

It does what it is meant to do really well. The enclosure is beautiful, so it is more of a studio/home amp in this iteration. I would not want to toss this in the trunk with the tire iron, or have the drunk guy spill his beer on it at some of the joints I get to play. But based upon what I saw from this and his guitars I imagine he could easily build one that is club ready. It is loud, but not crazy. So you'll need to mike it for most rock gigs other than small club. At jazz/blues combo things it should be fine.

So that's it. In my opinion, Lofton did a great job. This is a nice solid amp from a great guy.

Thanks again Lofton for letting me have the test drive!

[ConnemaraGuitar]

I'm totally blushing, Danno! And it's not hypertension.

Thank you for your hospitality, and great evening of music and conversation. Your feedback on the amp is incredibly thorough, and now I have some direction in which to head next (once I get the details done).

To other forum members, I'd like to point out that while many of you seem familiar to me through your posts, there's nothing like meeting in person. Danno is an awesome guy (despite his refusal to let me contribute to the cost of the pizza), with great talent and heart.

Thanks again, my friend!

[jarrod]

Hey guys, how about some pics of this amp?

Jarrod

[ConnemaraGuitar]

Hi, Folks,
At long last, here are some pics of the amp and speaker that Danno described above:

<a href="http://s390.photobucket.com/albums/oo349/connemaraguitars/?action=view&current=DSC00318.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i390.photobucket.com/albums/oo349/connemaraguitars/DSC00318.jpg" border="0" alt="5E3 Head &amp;amp; Cab Front"></a>

http://i390.photobucket.com/albums/oo349/connemaraguitars/DSC00319.jpg

http://i390.photobucket.com/albums/oo349/connemaraguitars/DSC00299.jpg

http://i390.photobucket.com/albums/oo349/connemaraguitars/DSC00306.jpg

The amp is a 5E3 Deluxe; I modified it since we did the "shoot-out" by adding an impedance selector switch. The speaker is a 12" Celestion Vintage 30 with dual ports. I need to tinker with the port lengths yet...but if someone out there has a Bogner Cube and is willing to measure the length of the ports I'd be real appreciative.

Oh, the wood is padouk. It's been sitting in my shop for a few years; I've used it for a few (acoustic) guitars so far, but these boards weren't quarter sawn. So they got to be cabinets.

Thanks for all the positive comments and let me know if you have questions.

[tom]

not sure about depth, but the bogner ports are a larger diameter.
very nice and clean amp!

[Suriel Zayas]

classy looking amp!:cool:

cheers!

[tom]

the bogner has two 3" dia. ports that are 2" long. the suhr has 2 3" ports that are 3" long.

[ConnemaraGuitar]

Thank you, Tom. That's really helpful information.

[tom]

one other noteworthy thing. the bogner cab has much thicker insulation on the walls than the suhr. the bogner has the speaker rear loaded and the suhr is front loaded.

[ConnemaraGuitar]

Once again, thank you, Tom!

I hope I haven't caused you to disassemble all your speaker cabs...

This has been an incredibly fun and rewarding project so far. Getting to spend time with Danno has been a gift, both in terms of being able to talk to someone with a generous and open heart, as well as benefiting from his technical expertise.

Incidentally, the speaker is front-mounted in a rabbet that keeps the metal edge of the speaker's front edge flush with the surface of the baffle. I was afraid to remove the foam strip from the front of the speaker for fear of damaging the cone.

Danno and I talked about a couple of paths forward, primarily related to the speaker cabinet.

The current cabinet is a closed, ported unit made of a dense hardwood. Open-backed cabinets are usually made of pine or plywood; closed cabinets are usually made of plywood. Neither pine nor most plywoods are all that rigid. I somehow think the idea of a rigid cabinet is best, just as the back and sides of an acoustic guitar are rigid. This way, sound is produced by the speaker and baffle only.

Danno was kidding me by saying the cabinets on my rig are too "nice"...that they belong in a living room rather than a club. Well, the wood is finished in a poly-acrylic finish which is impervious to any consumable liquid. You could probably chop vegetables on these suckers without leaving a mark.

I think hard maple would be a great wood for the speaker enclosures, although I tend to favor cherry for it's character.

Based on the information you provided, I'm going to adjust the ports to allow "tuning", mainly by adding a third port and making each one "telescopic."

Danno suggested altering the rear panel to allow it to be used as either a closed system or as an open system. I like this idea.

Last, there needs to be some tinkering with the speaker itself. Alnico or other?

For now, I'm going to stick with the amp component as is.

Thanks to all of you for your input and support!

One last thing: I forgot to give credit to my quality control inspector, Harley:

http://i390.photobucket.com/albums/oo349/connemaraguitars/DSC00316.jpg

[csd]

one other noteworthy thing. the bogner cab has much thicker insulation on the walls than the suhr. the bogner has the speaker rear loaded and the suhr is front loaded.
i was wondering if anyone would comment on the rear mounting of the speaker. +1 on that, a bit more bottom, wonder what the diff would be with padauk??

[dannopelli]

Hey I recognize that kitten!

Ok Lofton, I tried to PM this to you but it is WELL over the 1000 character limit. I felt it important to make some points. I truly love what you are doing with that amp, and my intention is to help. I really do not know this topic of speaker cab design as well as I suppose I should. So maybe folks can take apart my comments below to test for validity.

Main point. I think you should keep that cabinet just as it is. It is your reference point. I think you should make a duplicate that you can tinker with.

I tend to think about ends and means. Focus first upon what you are trying to accomplish. I learned this from my friend Dave in VA. Many times I "wanted" to get a specific guitar becasue I wanted it to "do" a certain thing. Dave, (kind of like Roy) would first direct me to explore what I wanted from a guitar, then explore the models that would produce that result.

Here are my supporting points:

Opening up a third port in a cabinet that small? Might that not be overkill? Might that make the cabinet sound too loose?

Making the cabinet convertible? Even though that is my suggestion, how might that change affect rigity and tone?

From my recollection the amp itself is voiced a bit loose. Note I am not saying that is bad. It is just its character. Since the amp project is basically to marry one to the other, I think the consideration of the final product has to include that as well as how both the cabinet and amp work with other non Lofton Harris Design projects. (pretty cool how I made up a company name for you!)

My expereince with the various special edition "hardwood" cabinet amps made over the years by Mesa and Fender were they had a much faster attack and tighter tone. I have played numerous Mesa Marks in both production and special edition trim, and never liked the special ones. The bottom end was not anywhere near as good as the production model cabs. Way to crisp. They sounded honky. They looked great as furniture, but did not sound so hot. (inject the IMHO disclaimer here)

Yet I did not find that issue with Lofton's cab. I think he might have the correct balance now. The V30, plus the warm loose amp, matched to a ported hardwood cabinet makes for a warm, yet accurate enclosure. If you recall we ran a Fender Twin through it and got similarly very pleasing results.

For me that cab was what I like about Anderson and DR Z. They are very warm, complex and rich sounding. Yet they have a somewhat quicker response that makes them unique. My feeling is the cabinet design currently achieves that.

So what does one do?

I would suggest make another cabinet. And buy a few different speakers. Use the one you have for "reference." Make a duplicate with the exact same specs, and then one by one change the options.

I guess my point is if you carve up the one you have you will only have memory for comparison. But if you create a duplicate, and then toy with speakers, convertible back, baffle design, etc, you always have the original to compare to as your reference point.

Anyway, that is my $.02. I hope it helps.

[ConnemaraGuitar]

Hey, Danno,
Your observations are dead on...I shouldn't be messing with this rig.

So it's back to the shop to build some more cabinets!

At what point, though, should my wife start complaining about a dining room full of amps?

Take care!

PS We thoroughly enjoyed your company Tuesday night!

[tom]

danno's comment about having a standard is right on. the only way to evaluate something is going back and forth with the standard and the "new" one as quickly as possible. also his 3 cabinet rule would be excellent so you can test cabs and speakers. not to derail, but we have recently done a crazy amount of pickup listening and design and having a standard is so important or you end up chasing your tail seeking what you think you remember.

[dannopelli]

I had a blast too!

I guess we could start filling up one of my barns with amps and cabs?

[ConnemaraGuitar]

Tube amp building is addictive! Anybody out there know of a 12-step program that can help me?

After the first project (which is finally finished except for better handles on the speaker cab), I've initiated the following:

A second 5E3 Deluxe just like the first, again using Mercury Magnetics trannies. This will be the amp I use to tinker with various components to see what happens.

A 5E8-A (ala Fender "Twin Amp"). This one's totally from "scratch," although I did break down and buy a chassis. MM trannies and choke.

Dave Hunter's book "The Guitar Amp Handbook" includes plans for a small (8 watt) amp he calls the "Two Stroke." It looks similar to a Fender Champ circuit with beefed up power and output transformers and an odd configuration of capacitors.

I bit, and started ordering parts. Unfortunately, the chapter was not thoroughly edited before publication and has a number of critical errors. Like specifying a. 0.047 microferad capacator when it should have been 0.0047.

In an effort to sell a kit version (for $1,000.00!!!), Hunter altered the plan significantly, and although he issued corrections for the book's plan, it's proving difficult to get certain specifics clarified.

In early January I hope to host an audition of these amps so interested folks can get together and play some music. Now that Danno is a gentleman farmer we may even ask him to host the event in his "barn."

Now that I have 4 amps "under my belt," there are a couple of things I learned:

For someone who's only formal training is in clinical psychology, figuring out how to build amps from schematics and layout diagrams has required far more patience than I thought I was capable of. There are lots of nuances.

It's not much different than learning to build guitars. Some knowledge can come only from making mistakes, and most of those can only be corrected by a "do over."

Starting with a kit that has good directions is a must! I recommend the Tweed Deluxe kit from SDG.

Now I need guidance from you good forum members.

I intend to keep amps and speakers in separate cabinets for the time being.

1. What speaker cab and hardware components would you suggest? I have a few 12" Celestion Vintage 30s on the shelf, but suspect I should try some others.

2. Should I stick with 1 x 12s or do some 2 x 12s?

Thanks for all your past comments, encouragement and feedback. In the next few days I'm going to put together some information about costs and time. If nothing else, it may help folks understand why tube amps are expensive, and why some makes are probably a better value than others. Pics, too.

Might also motivate one or two of you to attempt a project of your own.

[dannopelli]

Lots of room in the barn and really good power supply for a Central PA amp shoot out! I have five amps, plus a VERY nice PA.

We'll need a few drummers and bass players. Keyboards too.

Did I mention the barn is renovated with Central Air, two 42" flat screen TV's and surround sound?

[tom]

too bad that you and your barn aren't in newbury park!

[dannopelli]

too bad that you and your barn aren't in newbury park!

There is a general aviation airport nine miles away. You and your buddies could fly AIRTom right in, and we'll pick you up! This is a B&B so we have rooms to let for up to three couples, four in a pinch!

[tom]

tempting, but AIRTom will only fly as high as i can jump and gravity keeps it from going more than about 3 feet at a time.

[David]

Hey Danno is yours the GreenCastle Estate?
Also let me know about the amp-in-D-barn orgy, I would love to hang, and can bring a drummer with... best David

[dannopelli]

Hey Danno is yours the GreenCastle Estate?
Also let me know about the amp-in-D-barn orgy, I would love to hang, and can bring a drummer with... best David

Yes. We are Greencastle Estate. Eqaul distance to Antietam and Gettysburg. Equal distance to Liberty and White Tail Ski resorts.

Maybe in the spring we can set up something.

[ConnemaraGuitar]

OK, guys. I'm sorry I mentioned the barn :rolleyes: (although I think a gathering at Danno's is an awesome idea :D )!

Tom, I bet your brother Roy can fly the plane 'cause he's one of the most talented and diverse people I've ever met! We can get Elixir to sponsor the event and invite Buzzy to give a seminar on tuning.

So what speaker cabs should I build???

[FFOGG]

http://www.bedandbreakfast.com/photo-greencastle-pa-greencastle_estate.html


Is this it ?????????/

[dannopelli]

http://www.bedandbreakfast.com/photo-greencastle-pa-greencastle_estate.html


Is this it ?????????/

That's us. The main house is over 200 years old. The property was first established with a log cabin in the 1700's.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b342/dannopelli/Greencastle%20Estate/IMG_1856.jpg http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b342/dannopelli/Greencastle%20Estate/IMG_1850.jpg http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b342/dannopelli/Greencastle%20Estate/IMG_1858.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b342/dannopelli/Greencastle%20Estate/PB014864.jpg http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b342/dannopelli/Greencastle%20Estate/2775Buchanan2.jpg http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b342/dannopelli/Greencastle%20Estate/PB014871.jpg http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b342/dannopelli/Greencastle%20Estate/DSCN4095.jpg http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b342/dannopelli/Greencastle%20Estate/DSCN4127.jpg http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b342/dannopelli/Greencastle%20Estate/DSCN4111.jpg

[csd]

that's a beautiful property danno. good for you!
the stone on that house is sweet, awesome winter shots!

[tom]

now i really wish you and that barn were in newbury park. but what's that white stuff all over the place?

[irish blues]

That's one heck of a barn!!

[dannopelli]

It's kind of an illusion. The picture does not show that it is three pieces. On the left is a machine/garage building. The center was the "barn" now renovated. And the right is a stable. We do not have horses, but our neighbors use it. In return they snowplow our drives and till our vegetable garden for us in the spring.

OK BACK TO LOFTON!

You should try one or two of Celestion's modern speakers, maybe some Weber stuff and definitely some Altecs or Jensen. You can also consider some things that emulate vintage speakers by companies like Tone Tubby and Eminence, etc.

Since you are building vintage style heads, my $.02 would be to go with speakers that would have been stock back in the day, or things that would be similar. Kind of a NOS approach.

Also, you might want to consider a 2x10 cab. The right pair of 10" speakers can sound better than a single 12". I know my Maz Jr 2x10 sounds all warm and glorious to me!