How did we miss this thread?

[sylvanshine]

There is a thread started over at TGP a couple of months back that was an interesting discussion about Anderson, Suhr, Lentz and Grosh resale values. About mid-way through, Ed. Z throws out this line

"Anderson? I know for a fact you will get a brand new Anderson that was never touched by Tom during production. Period."

No one really called him out on it except John Suhr. Makes me :mad:

TGP Thread (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?s=&threadid=71817)

[Stan Malinowski]

Jay,

I followed up your response on TGP.

I saw this thread a week or so ago but decided to let it go. THere are few inaccurancies in comments made in the thread:
1) The TAG comment you reference
2) Numerous accusations that trhe resale value of Suhr guitars is substantially higher than Andersons. In addressing this all you have to do to disprove this point is look at eBay. The opening or desired prices for Suhrs are generally higher than Andersons, but the fact is these Suhrs rarely sell at all on eBay. I have seen some of the same Suhr Classics with opening bids at $1700 auctioned over and over again with no bids. In reality all botique guitars are difficult to sell.

I have long given up on trying to "swim against the current" over at TGP when it comes to Andersons. That's why my home is here!

[Stan Malinowski]

Just curious, is Mr Hanky a TA Forum member?

[sylvanshine]

Stan-

You have more self-control than I do. I am proud of myself for rewritting my response 10-12 times before I decided on the high(er) road.

It is an interesting thread over there, regardless of Dr. InaccuraZ.

I do find TGP helpful for amp and pedal stuff. And of course the For Sale section is superb. I think it is awesome that so many builders chime in over there, but am in agreement that there is only one builder that I really care about. And he is exclusively here.

[Stan Malinowski]

I actually have had a couple of dealings with Ed Z (originator of the referenced TA comment) and found him to be pretty friendly and honest. I have no idea of where he would have got that incorrect info about TAG.

Also annoying that the "TA sounds sterile" came up again in that thread, another issue I am tired of hearing about.

I almost reposnded to TGP thread with the following:
"All of the botique builders mentioned here provide instruments that are made to extremely high quality standards. In fact the difference between most of the builder's instruments is so small it comes down to perosnal preferences in small details. I presentl own both Andersons and Suhrs and find all are quality instruments. One of the reasons I prefer the Andersons is the aspect of buying a guitar built by people who make you feel like you are a family member! Roy, Tom and the TAG will take al the time you need in answering your questions. Never do they make you feel like you are bothering them. I have owned a few other brands of botique guitars and talked (better way to phrase it is I attempted to talk) to the builders. I have ended all my phone conversations with other builders feling like I was bothering them asking a question or expressing a concern about their product. "

When I am over at TGP I don't want to come across as a rigid Anderson fanatic and tend to avoid topics like this thread. It is hard not to notice the rigid-"BrandX" lovers over there who are very hard-line in their brand prefernce.

Just my 2 cents worth!

[sylvanshine]

When I am over at TGP I don't want to come across as a rigid Anderson fanatic and tend to avoid topics like this thread.
I'm always hyper-sensitive to not come off this way too. Now days, I don't jump on guitar threads with anything but technical info.

[dkaplowitz]

Yeah, TGP has a lot of the people who ape the "sterile" thing. There have been a couple threads recently with some schlubs saying that Andersons "feel sterile" too. I couldn't help but reply and ask what they meant by sterile feeling, but they never replied. Where these people get this stuff I'll never know.

Anyway, TGP like any board dealing with this stuff is comprised of all kinds of people. My guess is the majority of people are just followers and ape what someone more dominant says, or they just ape the first thing they heard about this or that. I've learned not to let even overwhelming opinions expressed there (or anywhere) unduly influence my choices anymore.

A funny example of the strange herd mentality there is that everyone there seems to agree that Gibson's QC is highly inconsistent any more -- and that boutique guitars are way more consistent and arguably much better quality. Nevertheless, any Les Paul posted in their emporium sells in like 3 minutes, whereas fairly priced Andersons, Suhrs, Grosh, etc. etc. can sit up there for weeks waiting for a buyer. I always find that kinda' funny.

I love the site though, lotsa' good people there (even if they're just human like me). And I've learned tons from them, and to boot I've gotten some nice gear from the emporium.

[sylvanshine]

Ed Z. is a good egg. He cleared things up in his replys.

[Stan Malinowski]

Dave,

Please don't get my comments wrong, I spend a lot of time at TGP and have a lot of respect for many of the guys over there. I too have learned a lot from reading the TGP posts, but like Jay I usually only post in threads where tech info is asked for. The hard-line opinions of a few members always makes me think twice about responding to posts which are opinion oriented.

[bruce]

This just goes to show how weird this posting medium is with regards to ''facts". If Mr, Dr, Mrs, whatever Z knows for a "fact, period" that Tom doesn't touch guitars while in production, then he is very miss-informed, but more importantly needs a spanking, a serious time-out, and needs to spend a day at the shop to witness Tom himself in action.

Mr. Z, did you get your facts by visiting the shop?? I didn't think so.

Buh-Bye

[sonsop]

And the irony of it all?

The pointless and mundane taste great / less filling / my dog's bigger than your dog type of threads always get the most ink. I guess deep down inside everybody loves to get as close as possible to a good train wreck.

Misery always finds it's way into a rowdy crowd.

[Chops]

Hey, wait a minute: is it true? I own, and have owned even more, a number of Anderson guitars but never bought them with the expectation that they were assembled, wired, painted or tested by a guy named Tom Anderson. I mean they could have been, but at this point in the Company's existence is it unreasonable to assume that there aren't other employees doing much of the hands-on work? Does Tom Anderson touch every guitar built by TAG? Does he never take vacations, go on marketing trips, have days where he needs to meet with lawyers and accountants? I own several Suhr guitars as well, and don't necessarily assume they were built by John Suhr either.

[Stan Malinowski]

Does Tom Anderson touch every guitar built by TAG? Does he never take vacations, go on marketing trips, have days where he needs to meet with lawyers and accountants?

I would trust the input from Bruce Nelson, after-all he is at TAG every day and sees what goes on. One thing to remember is the process to build an Anderson doesn't occur in 2 or 3 days - it takes weeks. Starting from wood selction to neck construction, neck stabilization time, body construction, finsihing, assembly, etc - it's a fairly long process. A few days off for vacation, meetings, shows, etc wold still not prevent Tom from being involved in the building of a guitar at some point in its build cycle.

Chops, I will agree that Tom (or John Suhr or any other builder) cannot possibly do everything on every guitar they produce, but I believe at some point Tom does come into contact with all his creations before they leave the shop.

[sonsop]

If Mr, Dr, Mrs, whatever Z knows for a "fact, period" that Tom doesn't touch guitars while in production, then he is very miss-informed, but more importantly needs a spanking, a serious time-out,...


Now that's what I'm talkin' about!

One minute for every year of his age on the naughty seat will teach him right!

Can we do it? Can we! Can we!

[jimmieb]

I have long since stopped posting at TGP except to buy and sell. In a general way-after being around internet forums for over 5 years-it all becomes so utterly predictable and boring. Some people let their self-esteem get WAY too tied up in their gear. Evangelical posts about the next great thing then the inevitable flame wars when someone disagrees-it just goes on and on. I have recently watched people getting angry and upset over a damn tuner of all things. Ya know in my experience forums and discussion pages are great until they reach a certain size and popularity. The Anderson Forum is in a great place right now-I hope it stays this way for a long time.

Here, Here and amen! It seems we all get a little too serious and righteously dogmatic on our own opinions and brand preferences even here sometimes. Overall this Forum has been extremely informative and friendly even when I was spilling out my own stupidy. I'm thankfull we can, so far, conduct the forum as well as we have. Not to point the finger at anyone, but some places are horrorible on the I-net! We are fortunate to have as many class people as we have here. This seems like a good lesson to me not to corrupt a good thing.

Jimmie B

[BoraBora]

...I mean they could have been, but at this point in the Company's existence is it unreasonable to assume that there aren't other employees doing much of the hands-on work? Does Tom Anderson touch every guitar built by TAG? Does he never take vacations, go on marketing trips, have days where he needs to meet with lawyers and accountants?...

Based on my two visits to the Anderson shop this past year I can say with complete certainty that Tom has a hand in every Anderson guitar that comes out of their shop.

My first visit was a guided tour by Tom himself. During this visit, Tom took time out of his busy day to show me all the steps involved in building the guitars we all love. One of those steps is when Tom suits up and jumps into the spray booth to paint all our beautiful Andersons.

My second visit was to pick up my completed Classic. Before I could pick up the guitar and take it home, Tom had to personally play and sign off on the guitar to make sure it was set-up correctly and built to his exacting standards. He does this to every guitar before it leaves the shop.

:)

[tom]

i didn't bother to read this thread until today. you all know i take that stuff personally, so i avoid it. i will clear a few things up.
1. i do play every guitar we make.
2. i paint at least the color on every guitar we make.
3. not many necks get made that i have not done some of the work on.
4. i make all pickguards and plates.
5 i make all corwdster bridges.
6. i have not had a 2 week vacation in 20 years. we started closing for a week in august a few years ago so i could at least get a week off.
7. i'll stop here cause this is getting old.

[1990hollow-t]

....and thats why we love ya! :)

[Marty S Horne]

I actually saw a post where someone said Anderson guitars lack soul. I responded that Andersons are extremely well built guitars that sound and play great. It's the guitarist's job to provide the soul.

[Chops]

i didn't bother to read this thread until today. you all know i take that stuff personally, so i avoid it. i will clear a few things up.
1. i do play every guitar we make.
2. i paint at least the color on every guitar we make.
3. not many necks get made that i have not done some of the work on.
4. i make all pickguards and plates.
5 i make all corwdster bridges.
6. i have not had a 2 week vacation in 20 years. we started closing for a week in august a few years ago so i could at least get a week off.
7. i'll stop here cause this is getting old.

That clears it up! No reason to take it personally. I've bought nine of your guitars, and I bought them because they were fine guitars. I had no idea if you were working alone (although I kind of doubted it because of the number of your guitars I see for sale), or if you had tens or even hundreds of employees. It was interesting to learn of the level of personal involvement you continue to maintain.

[morty]

It`s understandable, that Tom takes things personaly! But it seems like the users of this forum are very polite to eachother! we have some forums in Norway, whit a lot og 15-17year old members who think they are the worlds best guitarplayers.

I have also read that Anderson is sterile sounding.. I think the reason some people say that, is because the Anderson guitars are so clear and well defined! they have so good tone separation, and when you strum a chord you can almost hear every string. When I compare my Fender against my Anderson, the Fender actualy have more sustain unplugged, and the sound have more bottom, but it have less sustain plugged, and stringseparation and clarity can not be compared. the detail finish is miles and miles away from the Anderson. In my opinion the Andersons cut trough the mix in live situation, better than my Fender. Even our drummer coment, that he could hear more details when I played my Anderson!!

Happy playing everyone!!!

[dannopelli]

All ya'all know this is just music, right?

Do you like the guitar? For what ever reason, or reasons, do you like the guitar? Obviously you do enough to buy it and still play it.

Nuff said there.

It is said that the qualities of a leader are represented in the people he leads. It follows then that the products they provide will to some extent emulate his qualities.

That is why I like my Andersons. Best friggin geetars I own!

[Stan Malinowski]

It is said that the qualities of a leader are represented in the people he leads. It follows then that the products they provide will to some extent emulate his qualities.


That is why I like my Andersons. Best friggin geetars I own!

Danno,

WELL put!!! Agree with you 110%!!!

[mbrown3]

i didn't bother to read this thread until today. you all know i take that stuff personally, so i avoid it. i will clear a few things up.
1. i do play every guitar we make.
2. i paint at least the color on every guitar we make.
3. not many necks get made that i have not done some of the work on.
4. i make all pickguards and plates.
5 i make all corwdster bridges.
6. i have not had a 2 week vacation in 20 years. we started closing for a week in august a few years ago so i could at least get a week off.
7. i'll stop here cause this is getting old.

Glad this is all true, but no need to justify yourself to us. We love the guitars that TA puts out, regardless of whose magic touch is on them. It's nice to know you're involved, but I am more interested in the quality of the product itself than whose particular hands touched it (no offense to you!). Obviously there are certain people who know more about what they are doing than others, but if they can impart that knowledge to those who work with them, and the levels of quality standards are high (which in this case they obviously are), this is a moot issue for me. In any case, I didn't think twice about it with regards to whether you're involved or not. It's a petty, silly discussion on the part of the accusers. But for me this isn't even the important thing. The quality of the product is...and yours is second to none. So don't fret it (pun intended). We're with you no matter what accusations are made by people who have nothing better to do!

[tom]

no offense taken, it should not matter what part i play, i was just pissed that someone who should know better made such a stupid uninformed comment.

[mbrown3]

Yep, I'm with you there! Better to pay it no mind and just go about your thing. We're with you...

[Ian Hurtt]

Interesting thread, guys. I'm a regular over at the Gear Page, and spend a bit of time on it about every day. There are some people that have some black/white opinions on things, but I think in general most of the active posters are willing to listen and have fairly open minds. Now, to the topic of Anderson's on TPG.

Keep in mind that on the internet new is cool and interesting. I think that Anderson's have been around long enough, and grown large enough that many people take them for granted. Kind of the same thing Mesa Boogie has gone through. At one time, Boogie (like Anderson) was "the boutique" amp company. Now, all the new guys are getting the attention.

I've heard a few times that Anderson's are sterile sounding. I'm not really sure what that means, to be honest. I'm guessing that those people felt that the guitar lacked some type of flavor or personality. To some people only a vintage strat or Les Paul will do. I've never owned an Anderson, but I've played a bunch. Each and every one of them were built superbly, looked fantastic and sounded terrific. One day I hope to get one, but I need to get a bit more educated on the different neck shapes, and talk to some guys about the tonal combination I'm looking for. That's why I'm here!

[pluto]

There is a thread started over at TGP a couple of months back that was an interesting discussion about Anderson, Suhr, Lentz and Grosh resale values. About mid-way through, Ed. Z (Dr. Z amps) throws out this line

"Anderson? I know for a fact you will get a brand new Anderson that was never touched by Tom during production. Period."

No one really called him out on it except John Suhr. Makes me :mad:

TGP Thread (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?s=&threadid=71817)

p.s. I'm selling my Route 66.

Are you sure Ed Z is Dr. Z? Dr. Z's name is Mike Zaite.

[Stan Malinowski]

Are you sure Ed Z is Dr. Z? Dr. Z's name is Mike Zaite.

Ed Z is not Dr Z or in any way related to Dr Z Amps. Ed Z lives out in the Seattle, Washington area. I have spoke to Ed a couple of times in the past, he's really a good guy.

[tom]

then i won't buy one of his amps either ;)

[sylvanshine]

Wow, my MAJOR BAD. :o

Apologies for being misinformed.

[BrianH]

I was a little confused about the Ed Z being Dr. Z business.
We deal with Mike (Dr. Z) on a daily basis, and it's a lot like dealing with Anderson. Very small and hands on, and Mike touches everything he puts his name on.

As for Tom taking time off and all that other speculative stuff; what does it matter?
Crap like that is what makes forums a somewhat destructive and misleading place to gather information.

The instruments are great, end of story. I know for a fact that he never rests, but whether he does should not matter or influence someone’s decision towards purchasing one of his guitars.

[tom]

so let's see what we learned today.
person A bags on person B. person C tells person B that person A bagged on him(thinking it was person D). person B whines about person D making uninformed comments. person E says person A is not person D. person C apologizes for the missinformation. person B now apologizes for whining about person D. isn't the internet fun?
can person B still whine about person A? who's on first?

[BrianH]

Person A is.

[crash]

Wait a sec - is the headstock logo now going to change to a big 'B'?

[BrianH]

No, I think he will keep the name Anderson.
But personally, I like the idea of a big 'B'.

[bruce]

This thread is a great lesson on he said, she said. I vote for a removal before anyone else gets hurt.

[sylvanshine]

I removed the bad info from my original post, which is something I should have done sooner. Again, my apologies for the assertion that Ed. Z was associated with Dr. Z amps. Although Ed. Z made nice later in the TGP thread and has shown himself to be a stand up guy, he did make the original statement. I stand by the quote.